http://www.catholicdadsonline.org/posts/1427/bored-distracted-and-stimulated/ Because we need all the help we can get Wed, 08 Feb 2012 16:43:34 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2.1 http://www.catholicdadsonline.org/posts/1427/bored-distracted-and-stimulated/#comment-2908 RobK Fri, 31 Aug 2007 14:23:00 +0000 http://www.catholicdadsonline.org/posts/1427#comment-2908 Joanne, please refer to the comment policy at <a href="http://catholic-dads.blogspot.com/2007/05/comment-policy.html">http://catholic-dads.blogspot.com/2007/05/comment...</a>Respectful disagreement is fine, your tone is coming off a bit heated. Let's maintain a tone of civility. This is just blogging and opinions after all. Joanne, please refer to the comment policy at http://catholic-dads.blogspot.com/2007/05/comment…Respectful disagreement is fine, your tone is coming off a bit heated. Let's maintain a tone of civility. This is just blogging and opinions after all.

]]> http://www.catholicdadsonline.org/posts/1427/bored-distracted-and-stimulated/#comment-2907 Joanne Fri, 31 Aug 2007 13:36:00 +0000 http://www.catholicdadsonline.org/posts/1427#comment-2907 I guess we'll have to agree to disagree that you were judging that family at Mass. I think you were, and I know the difference between judging and observing. If you and your wife have 'formed' a calm child, please - do tell! I am truly interested in hearing. My guess is that you won't be able to because it's LUCKY that you have such a calm child. You can't form a calm child, anymore than I can form a somewhat crazy (but charming!) child. You sound very naive. I guess we'll have to agree to disagree that you were judging that family at Mass. I think you were, and I know the difference between judging and observing. If you and your wife have 'formed' a calm child, please – do tell! I am truly interested in hearing. My guess is that you won't be able to because it's LUCKY that you have such a calm child. You can't form a calm child, anymore than I can form a somewhat crazy (but charming!) child. You sound very naive.

]]> http://www.catholicdadsonline.org/posts/1427/bored-distracted-and-stimulated/#comment-2896 Domenico Bettinelli Sun, 26 Aug 2007 18:23:00 +0000 http://www.catholicdadsonline.org/posts/1427#comment-2896 Joanne, if I say that I noticed that obese children are more often seen eating junk food I am making an observation. A judgment would be to say that the parents are bad parents because they let their child eat the junk food. Yet nowhere did I say that the parents were bad parents for letting their children have "stuff" to distract them. I'm just saying I would make a different choice based on my experience and observations.I would be less likely to observe such things in Mass if the children in question were not sitting directly in front of me banging their toys upon the bench. Were I a saint, I might aspire to such levels of focus on the Mass, but alas I am not quite that fortunate. I can be distracted, ironically, because I'm just a fallible human being working out his salvation trying to become a better Christian.As for the calmness of my daughter, calling it luck is to denigrate the hard work that I and mainly my wife have put forth to form and educate our daughter.To ascribe it to luck is just as much a judgment as if someone were to say it's your fault your child is ill-behaved (which I'm not saying; I'm just making a point). Joanne, if I say that I noticed that obese children are more often seen eating junk food I am making an observation. A judgment would be to say that the parents are bad parents because they let their child eat the junk food. Yet nowhere did I say that the parents were bad parents for letting their children have "stuff" to distract them. I'm just saying I would make a different choice based on my experience and observations.I would be less likely to observe such things in Mass if the children in question were not sitting directly in front of me banging their toys upon the bench. Were I a saint, I might aspire to such levels of focus on the Mass, but alas I am not quite that fortunate. I can be distracted, ironically, because I'm just a fallible human being working out his salvation trying to become a better Christian.As for the calmness of my daughter, calling it luck is to denigrate the hard work that I and mainly my wife have put forth to form and educate our daughter.To ascribe it to luck is just as much a judgment as if someone were to say it's your fault your child is ill-behaved (which I'm not saying; I'm just making a point).

]]> http://www.catholicdadsonline.org/posts/1427/bored-distracted-and-stimulated/#comment-2894 Joanne Sun, 26 Aug 2007 09:55:00 +0000 http://www.catholicdadsonline.org/posts/1427#comment-2894 When did you judge someone? Right here:"Yet, I can’t help but notice that the kids who are most disruptive in public, who are most likely to be bored with what’s going on and with what their parents have brought to occupy them, are the kids who have the most “stuff” surrounding them.Perhaps part of the reason why some children can’t sit quietly through Mass or won’t behave in public or will grow up to be bored by Mass is because, as Fr. Fortuna said, they are deeply profoundly bored because of the constant barrage of external stimuli."You can call it 'noticing' but it is 'judging', and that's all there is to it. I'm not saying it's a terrible thing, Lord knows we all do it, but I just think it's odd to do it while talking about *Mass*, when presumably you should have better things to 'notice'.I can't remember if my son was better behaved 15 months ago, he was just starting to walk, so probably yes. But good for you, lucky you, it's nice (I imagine) to have a well behaved, calm child. I do not, although I am hoping as he gets older he will calm down a little bit. Please don't worry, I don't feel judged by you, as I don't know you, nor do I care what you think. In fact, I'm sorry to say that I was judging you and your 'noticing' what other people must be doing with their children. I was merely suggesting that you spend your time at Mass following the Mass, and perhaps thanking God that you have such a well behaved child. When did you judge someone? Right here:"Yet, I can’t help but notice that the kids who are most disruptive in public, who are most likely to be bored with what’s going on and with what their parents have brought to occupy them, are the kids who have the most “stuff” surrounding them.Perhaps part of the reason why some children can’t sit quietly through Mass or won’t behave in public or will grow up to be bored by Mass is because, as Fr. Fortuna said, they are deeply profoundly bored because of the constant barrage of external stimuli."You can call it 'noticing' but it is 'judging', and that's all there is to it. I'm not saying it's a terrible thing, Lord knows we all do it, but I just think it's odd to do it while talking about *Mass*, when presumably you should have better things to 'notice'.I can't remember if my son was better behaved 15 months ago, he was just starting to walk, so probably yes. But good for you, lucky you, it's nice (I imagine) to have a well behaved, calm child. I do not, although I am hoping as he gets older he will calm down a little bit. Please don't worry, I don't feel judged by you, as I don't know you, nor do I care what you think. In fact, I'm sorry to say that I was judging you and your 'noticing' what other people must be doing with their children. I was merely suggesting that you spend your time at Mass following the Mass, and perhaps thanking God that you have such a well behaved child.

]]> http://www.catholicdadsonline.org/posts/1427/bored-distracted-and-stimulated/#comment-2892 Domenico Bettinelli Sat, 25 Aug 2007 08:20:00 +0000 http://www.catholicdadsonline.org/posts/1427#comment-2892 Joanne: when did I judge anyone else? Please cite examples. Instead I cited principles. Saying that parents' action influence children's behavior is not a judgment, it's a statement of fact.In every case, I carefully spoke of our decisions about raising our daughter (who is actually 15 months so younger than your son.)In fact, I said several times that some kids are naturally boisterous and that it has nothing to do with whether the parents made good or bad decisions.You made different decisions so you feel judged. Might I suggest that you're feeling judged is not me judging you, but you projecting that upon me.Tom: I'm not saying we shouldn't try to occupy our children's attention (I prefer that phrase to the word "distraction") during Mass. It is unrealistic to expect a toddler to be as attentive as an adult. But I would submit that there are good attention-holders and bad ones; "distractions" that inculcate good habits and those that inculcate bad ones that will later have to be unlearned.This is not a knock against my sister--her kids are older and she had to learn on the job while I benefit from her experience--but her kids have so come to associate going to Mass with getting special food that they see it as an opportunity for eating and so now she's trying to break that hab it. Joanne: when did I judge anyone else? Please cite examples. Instead I cited principles. Saying that parents' action influence children's behavior is not a judgment, it's a statement of fact.In every case, I carefully spoke of our decisions about raising our daughter (who is actually 15 months so younger than your son.)In fact, I said several times that some kids are naturally boisterous and that it has nothing to do with whether the parents made good or bad decisions.You made different decisions so you feel judged. Might I suggest that you're feeling judged is not me judging you, but you projecting that upon me.Tom: I'm not saying we shouldn't try to occupy our children's attention (I prefer that phrase to the word "distraction") during Mass. It is unrealistic to expect a toddler to be as attentive as an adult. But I would submit that there are good attention-holders and bad ones; "distractions" that inculcate good habits and those that inculcate bad ones that will later have to be unlearned.This is not a knock against my sister–her kids are older and she had to learn on the job while I benefit from her experience–but her kids have so come to associate going to Mass with getting special food that they see it as an opportunity for eating and so now she's trying to break that hab it.

]]> http://www.catholicdadsonline.org/posts/1427/bored-distracted-and-stimulated/#comment-2886 Tom Dickinson Wed, 22 Aug 2007 15:36:00 +0000 http://www.catholicdadsonline.org/posts/1427#comment-2886 Joanne makes a valid point.I think it's best to try to get the child to be quiet and reverent in Mass, but this is not realistic for every child, and distractions may be the only option for parents who want to attend Mass as a family. We had a priest in our parish once who liked to describe the noisy little ones as his "children's choir." He recognized that the parents could be many other places, but they've chosen to celebrate the Eucharist with their children. Let's do our best to celebrate their presence, even if it can be an annoyance. Joanne makes a valid point.I think it's best to try to get the child to be quiet and reverent in Mass, but this is not realistic for every child, and distractions may be the only option for parents who want to attend Mass as a family. We had a priest in our parish once who liked to describe the noisy little ones as his "children's choir." He recognized that the parents could be many other places, but they've chosen to celebrate the Eucharist with their children. Let's do our best to celebrate their presence, even if it can be an annoyance.

]]> http://www.catholicdadsonline.org/posts/1427/bored-distracted-and-stimulated/#comment-2884 Joanne Wed, 22 Aug 2007 14:00:00 +0000 http://www.catholicdadsonline.org/posts/1427#comment-2884 My son is two, so maybe he's younger than your daughter or maybe he's just more badly behaved. Very possibly both! Maybe as a parent yourself, and as a Christian, you could try harder to not judge the person who is trying to attend Mass with their child, and it seems, trying to keep their child quiet. We take a book and often, food, so that our child is 'distracted' and doesn't run out of the pew. It's disheartening to think that parents around us who have older, or better behaved children are spending their time during Mass deciding how we could better parent our child. My son is two, so maybe he's younger than your daughter or maybe he's just more badly behaved. Very possibly both! Maybe as a parent yourself, and as a Christian, you could try harder to not judge the person who is trying to attend Mass with their child, and it seems, trying to keep their child quiet. We take a book and often, food, so that our child is 'distracted' and doesn't run out of the pew. It's disheartening to think that parents around us who have older, or better behaved children are spending their time during Mass deciding how we could better parent our child.

]]> http://www.catholicdadsonline.org/posts/1427/bored-distracted-and-stimulated/#comment-2880 JimmyV Tue, 21 Aug 2007 12:28:00 +0000 http://www.catholicdadsonline.org/posts/1427#comment-2880 Thanks for posting on this. I love this topic but am constantly annoyed by how otherwise intelligent adults react to it. I have to preface every sentence which leaves my mouth with the words, "In general" or I get the "some kids are just better behaved" response."My brother and I were drastically different growing up so I know something of inborn temperment. However, now that I am raising my second, I know that what this post suggests is correct. Strong general rules (morality & obedience) with personal focus on top. Thanks for posting on this. I love this topic but am constantly annoyed by how otherwise intelligent adults react to it. I have to preface every sentence which leaves my mouth with the words, "In general" or I get the "some kids are just better behaved" response."My brother and I were drastically different growing up so I know something of inborn temperment. However, now that I am raising my second, I know that what this post suggests is correct. Strong general rules (morality & obedience) with personal focus on top.

]]> http://www.catholicdadsonline.org/posts/1427/bored-distracted-and-stimulated/#comment-2878 Chris Lewis Mon, 20 Aug 2007 19:47:00 +0000 http://www.catholicdadsonline.org/posts/1427#comment-2878 Nice post. I agree, there's way too much background noise as a constant current in our lives. In fact, when I served as lector last week, I welcomed, stated the Mass intention, and then came to the line on the "script" where it said, "as a reminder, please silence all cell phones and pagers at this time." I couldn't help myself, I continued on, "better yet, turn it off if you are able, and completely remove that distraction from your life if but for an hour." Then I continued on with 2 or 3 announcements and asked the community to rise for the opening hymn. I guess you might say I "pontificated" a bit, but I couldn't help myself! Of course we have doctors on call in the community, and they have to leave their communication devices on...but the soccer moms don't, nor do the self-important businessment who aren't really expecting to do any business on a Sunday morning. Nice post. I agree, there's way too much background noise as a constant current in our lives. In fact, when I served as lector last week, I welcomed, stated the Mass intention, and then came to the line on the "script" where it said, "as a reminder, please silence all cell phones and pagers at this time." I couldn't help myself, I continued on, "better yet, turn it off if you are able, and completely remove that distraction from your life if but for an hour." Then I continued on with 2 or 3 announcements and asked the community to rise for the opening hymn. I guess you might say I "pontificated" a bit, but I couldn't help myself! Of course we have doctors on call in the community, and they have to leave their communication devices on…but the soccer moms don't, nor do the self-important businessment who aren't really expecting to do any business on a Sunday morning.

]]> http://www.catholicdadsonline.org/posts/1427/bored-distracted-and-stimulated/#comment-2876 Tom Dickinson Sun, 19 Aug 2007 17:54:00 +0000 http://www.catholicdadsonline.org/posts/1427#comment-2876 May I respectfully suggest . . .it sounds like you're doing everything right . . . but I would say that you might want to wait until number two arrives and see how he or she acts at a similar age before you give yourself too much credit.Some kids are just well behaved and even tempered by nature . . . from my own experience, they are sometimes joined by siblings who have very different natures. Same parents, all the same rules, but very different behavior. May I respectfully suggest . . .it sounds like you're doing everything right . . . but I would say that you might want to wait until number two arrives and see how he or she acts at a similar age before you give yourself too much credit.Some kids are just well behaved and even tempered by nature . . . from my own experience, they are sometimes joined by siblings who have very different natures. Same parents, all the same rules, but very different behavior.

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